Healing POTS & Hypermobility Through the Vagus Nerve and Shame Resiliency

[00:00:00] Hey there and welcome to Heal with Grace. I'm your host Grace Secker
[00:00:04] and I'm a holistic licensed therapist and nervous system coach who believes that the chronic and often unseen symptoms
[00:00:10] you're living with are a sign of something deeper going on. A sign that your nervous system needs attention. In each episode
[00:00:17] I'll share the science behind the most common chronic health disorders plus holistic health tips using mental physical and spiritual practices.
[00:00:25] You'll hear what I've learned in my journey and the true stories from our trusted guests
[00:00:30] so you can feel less alone in your experience and give yourself grace no matter what you're going through.
[00:00:35] So without further ado, settle in and get cozy. It's time to Heal with Grace.
[00:00:41] Hello and welcome back to the Heal with Grace podcast. I have a special guest Kendall today.
[00:00:47] She is a physical therapist, chronic illness health coach, biomedical engineer and integrative manual therapist.
[00:00:54] About 10 years ago
[00:00:55] she went from thriving to bedridden struck by symptoms that now knows to be associated with Ehlers-Danlos syndrome, which she'll talk about too.
[00:01:04] Specific types of diet exercise, manual therapy and meditation helped her get back to thriving and through that journey
[00:01:10] she devoted herself to learning everything she could and still does so that she can help people go through similar journeys to
[00:01:17] accessing their inherent healing potential.
[00:01:20] So I know Kendall because I actually started working with her.
[00:01:24] When I lived back in Austin and she helped me in so many different ways, especially when it came to hypermobility in my body and nervous system.
[00:01:33] So I will stop there and let her introduce herself. Hi Kendall, thanks for being here.
[00:01:38] Thanks so much for having me. Yeah, I think you did an awesome job introducing me.
[00:01:41] I don't know if I can top that but I'm really excited to be here and get to share some of what I've learned through my story
[00:01:46] and working with a lot of these people on similar journeys.
[00:01:49] Yeah. So what drew you into physical therapy and then really more, you're very niched in this.
[00:01:58] So what drew you into this niche with working, when I'll let you explain exactly what you do and who you work with?
[00:02:03] Yeah, to make a long story really short, started off on a super different track was like
[00:02:08] super athletic growing up, which I think was probably protective looking back at me strong.
[00:02:13] And then I wanted to go into construction and start off civil engineering,
[00:02:16] which is a very hard major. And I stopped sleeping, had some life stressors come up
[00:02:21] and probably wasn't eating the best big lifestyle change in college hormone changes all that
[00:02:26] around the time I started college. And then it was like in the course of a month or two,
[00:02:29] everything just went downhill that first year of college. And I just was like,
[00:02:33] what's going on with my body? My ribs stopped staying in place and they started popping and
[00:02:38] cracking and eventually got to where it was really painful when they did so and I couldn't
[00:02:42] breathe well. And my best positions were like walking and moving, not sitting, which was really
[00:02:49] hard to explain to people why I could walk and sit but I or walk and move, but I couldn't sit in a
[00:02:54] car or sit in the classroom. Anyway, I just remember sitting in this internship. And I had
[00:03:00] looked around for a few different pts, gone to doctors, most of their advice was
[00:03:04] lay in bed and take out bill. And here's sometime that year I got given like a lifetime
[00:03:09] handicap license. And I went there a few pts that were good, tried some different doctors,
[00:03:16] but nothing was really hitting the ringer. And I was attempting a internship with civil engineering
[00:03:23] and hated every second of it and was miserable in my own body trying to stand and work. And then
[00:03:27] finally found a PT that I was going to after that was he didn't know all the answers, but
[00:03:31] he was willing to problem solve with me. And he believed me and worked with me. He used
[00:03:36] a lot of osteopathic techniques on my ribs and got them in place held them there with some
[00:03:41] kt tape. And it was just like my favorite part of the day was going to see him my heartbeat
[00:03:45] faster. And I was like, Okay, I need to, I need to follow that. So ended up kind of jumping
[00:03:51] fields, stayed with engineering, but went biomedical engineering, figured PT is in some
[00:03:56] ways engineering the human body. And but with that more human component that I found
[00:04:02] I really liked and needed. So I finished that degree went on to get my doctorate in physical
[00:04:07] therapy and love a lot of things about physical therapy fields. I think there's a lot of value
[00:04:12] in everything that I learned. But the traditional way PT is often done in clinic is 15 to 30
[00:04:19] minutes with the therapist. And then you kind of get spit out into this very generic
[00:04:22] exercise field. And I think that works amazing for people dealing with post op and
[00:04:27] kind of with more traditional injuries that are maybe a little more acute and can heal quickly.
[00:04:33] But when you're dealing with chronic issues or complex issues, I think you just need more one
[00:04:37] on one care and you need a different approach. So I just became passionate about how do I give
[00:04:43] that approach how do I get that approach and was working in a few different industries started
[00:04:48] doing some public floor therapy that let me do that one on one work and long story short
[00:04:53] ended up having a lot of patients left one job and had all these patients but are like so where
[00:04:57] are we going and we want to follow you and slowly started my own thing and have been building that
[00:05:04] ever since now have a fully running practice with someone under me and basically I really
[00:05:09] we call it PT but we've started to almost offer different words sometimes just like a
[00:05:14] more osteopathic approach to wellness and life coaching with some physical therapy in their
[00:05:21] strong manual therapy focus when people are with me in clinic but yes trying to offer a
[00:05:28] safe place to problem solve and become more functional with people that are kind of
[00:05:33] struggling on that same journey. Hope that kind of sums up where how I got to where I am.
[00:05:37] Yeah I think so because oftentimes and myself included and honestly most people I probably
[00:05:43] have on here have some sort of personal history that makes them probably pretty great
[00:05:47] what they do because they understand the body in a totally different way and have now curated
[00:05:53] help if you will or services if you will to help that person the specific type of person so
[00:05:58] we mentioned Ehlers-Danlos syndrome and can you explain what that is in relation to hyper
[00:06:04] mobility so I've mentioned on here that I'm more on that hyper mobility scale but really
[00:06:09] understanding EDS Ehlers-Danlos has helped me understand my body too so can you give us
[00:06:15] an idea about what that is? Definitely so Ehlers-Danlos syndrome is plural and it's a collection of
[00:06:23] different syndromes that together basically are saying there's something different I don't
[00:06:29] like to use the word wrong but there's something different about the way our connective tissue forms
[00:06:34] likely some of them they don't quite even understand what's different from a cellular
[00:06:38] point of view but they know the body responds differently to different stimulus or forms
[00:06:42] differently some of those types have a genetic component so if you get genetically tested you
[00:06:47] can actually there's classical EDS, kyphotic EDS that affects the spine, there's some that affects
[00:06:52] the blood vessels and all those are made with slightly different types of collagen in particular
[00:06:57] for the most part but the most common type by far what is getting diagnosed a lot is hyper
[00:07:01] mobile Ehlers-Danlos syndrome which actually so far does not have a genetic component
[00:07:06] there is some research being done where they think they're getting closer to potentially
[00:07:09] creating like finding a cluster of genes is going to be more likely I think that
[00:07:14] make you more likely to develop hyper mobile Ehlers-Danlos syndrome but I think if I had to draw
[00:07:20] a line I think it's very hard to do between being hyper mobile or maybe having what's
[00:07:25] called hyper mobility spectrum disorder so not just your hyper mobile there's plenty of people
[00:07:30] that are hyper mobile and do awesome with life and never have an issue if the hyper
[00:07:33] mobility reaches too far of a point and your life circumstances are such that it exacerbates
[00:07:39] them then that hyper mobility can become dysfunctional and cause issues throughout the body and the
[00:07:44] joints and that would be hyper mobility spectrum disorder which I think now the EDS is getting
[00:07:50] bigger is sometimes not honored as much but it's just as debilitating in it and a very big thing
[00:07:56] and then somewhere along that spectrum you get to a point where I think probably the
[00:08:02] distinction would be that there's enough other involvement outside of just the joints
[00:08:07] because hyper mobile Ehlers-Danlos syndrome is for the most part a because there's no genetic component
[00:08:11] it's diagnosed by symptoms so if someone is very hyper mobile there's a scale you can pass for
[00:08:18] like how bendier joints are and they have things like there's a checklist but crowded pallet is
[00:08:24] a big one or deviated septum or hip these little papules on your heel that can point to it a
[00:08:31] family history of certain problems a mitral valve prolapse so that you put all this stuff together
[00:08:37] and it just means oh this connective tissue is probably affected a little more generally for
[00:08:42] this person and they're starting to deal with symptoms not just in their joints but with their
[00:08:46] nervous system a little bit more or with their gut a little bit more with their balance system a
[00:08:51] little bit more is a common one that I see and so if that gets broad enough you call it
[00:08:56] hyper mobile Ehlers-Danlos syndrome at least that's my opinion is I don't think it's as
[00:09:00] straight of a line as we want to make it if that's helpful what are some of the symptoms that people
[00:09:06] come into you for that would point them in direction that they have some type of hyper mobile
[00:09:11] and it's become an issue yeah so I have some patients to come in and there's like my knee
[00:09:16] dislocates every time I do this and when I get out of bed my hip dislocates sometimes or every
[00:09:21] time I turn my neck it pops but in a painful way and that's one of the first things I ask
[00:09:25] people like okay it pops but is it a problem because some people are just poppy and it's
[00:09:29] okay but if it's popping if it's dislocating out of alignment and causing issues it's a problem
[00:09:35] and if they've been like that their whole life and it's just not causing issues so that can be one
[00:09:38] of the big things that people first come in with a lot of times it's it's hit their nervous
[00:09:43] system a little bit more so because the blood vessels or other tissues there's different
[00:09:49] reasons we can get into in a minute for why they think that might overlap but a lot of
[00:09:52] those same patients are dealing with chronic fatigue with dysautonomia is a really strong
[00:09:58] overlap symptom headaches and migraines are really common and I think that often has to do with
[00:10:03] upper neck alignment that we work on a lot and with the nervous system so your vestibular nervous
[00:10:09] system is the part of your brain that knows where you're at in space and regulates your
[00:10:16] body because of that and that has been shown to be weaker in people with Ehlers-Danlos syndrome
[00:10:24] weaker but very trainable it's an easy system to to bring back up to par but for some reason
[00:10:29] with us just likes to yeah needs a little bit extra exercise to keep it going so those would be
[00:10:34] some of the big ones pelvic floor dysfunction can overlap commonly and that is another
[00:10:39] kind of niche that I work with for men and women is various public floor problems painless
[00:10:44] sex incontinence prolapse and like pre-postpartum some complications there with that population as
[00:10:50] well yeah those are some of the big ones yeah you miss it and you mentioned dysautotomy dysautotomia
[00:10:58] right can you describe that as well or maybe the difference between that and POTS I know I work
[00:11:05] with many people who well POTS is more much more common but they're trying to understand
[00:11:11] why what that is they're very hopeless around it because it just seems like they're going to be
[00:11:15] stuck in a bubble forever yeah so can you describe that a little bit and I think you
[00:11:20] mentioned you had some history with it too so can you give us examples yeah so POTS you can have
[00:11:27] separate from Ehlers-Danlos syndrome but there's a little bit of that overlap so
[00:11:31] and I kind of fall in that overlap so I've had a little bit of both POTS is a version of
[00:11:35] dysautonomia dysautonomia just means dysregulation of the autonomic nervous system so we have our
[00:11:43] conscious nervous system I'm moving my bicep right now I'm controlling this I'm blinking my eyes
[00:11:47] and then you have your autonomic nervous system that is subconsciously blinking your eyes all day
[00:11:52] you know I can forcefully take a deep breath or I can subconsciously breathe all day your autonomic
[00:11:57] nervous system also is like I call it automatic to help remember so it's you know regulating
[00:12:03] your heartbeat regulating your breath rate regulating your how wide or narrow your blood
[00:12:10] vessels are they contract or expand all day based on where you're trying to get blood to
[00:12:14] you know when you're cold your your body will prioritize and send the blood up to your organ
[00:12:19] so we can really control where the blood flow goes in our body autonomia is on the
[00:12:22] autonomic nervous system for some reason stops regulating us as well so oftentimes
[00:12:30] can hit after a virus we're seeing a big uptick in it after COVID right now so it's getting more
[00:12:34] pressing research there's a silver lining but I know there's a lot of people overwhelmed by those
[00:12:39] symptoms right now but it can come after different viruses in a stressful time with hormone shifts
[00:12:44] there's a lot of reasons and there's people that have it from birth too I will say for the
[00:12:49] people for everyone but for the people that develop it secondary to something else to give
[00:12:54] them hope I've seen so many patients and heard so many stories of people truly recovering
[00:12:59] going to remission and it might be that people are maybe always prone to like knowing oh I can't
[00:13:04] let this much stress build up or I could have a flare again but it's not a permanent problem in
[00:13:10] your body it's something that can be I believe most often trained like you can work with your
[00:13:17] brain and work with your body and come up with a new normal like reestablish that normal
[00:13:23] baseline of homeostasis in your body it's just figuring out what your body's asking for
[00:13:27] what your brain's asking for that it needs to get there so then how does that show up in people
[00:13:31] like what do they experience to where they'd be diagnosed with that so normally if we're laying
[00:13:37] down or kind of in this relaxed relaxed feeling and then you stand back up and the blood your
[00:13:43] blood vessels in your legs need to contract in order to get the blood that was just chilling
[00:13:47] in your legs up to your heart now against gravity because now you're fighting gravity
[00:13:51] one of the key things with this I don't know me that kind of keys people in as oftentimes
[00:13:54] when you do that that doesn't happen very fast it's like the blood doesn't actually get to your head
[00:13:58] and so you get those you know either black or white behind your eyes and you get really lightheaded
[00:14:02] orthostatic hypotension so that's called and that can be one issue the end of itself isn't
[00:14:09] pots but pots is what they say if that keeps going on not to say the black behind your eyes
[00:14:15] but the dysregulation the nervous system for three minutes after you're standing that's like
[00:14:19] what technically classifies pots is one of the tests for it and it doesn't have to be happen
[00:14:24] happen every day it can just be sometimes based on your hydration levels and your stress levels
[00:14:28] and stuff like that but basically it's when you change possessions when you stand upright for a
[00:14:35] long time when you get stress your body should be able to increase your heart rate and decrease
[00:14:41] your blood pressure increase your blood pressure and decrease your heart rate that gets more complex
[00:14:44] but it should be able to do that in order to keep your brain especially getting blood flow and if it
[00:14:50] can't if or if it's not for some reason then that would be called dysautonomia so a lot of the
[00:14:55] symptoms can be feeling very lightheaded with standing for a while feeling very fatigued and
[00:15:00] just not understanding brain fog is common and I believe that's really like blood flow in and
[00:15:05] out of the brain issue and let's see other ones cold achy legs some swelling legs can be common
[00:15:13] not as common as you think arms too like you can actually have your arms or are like swelling
[00:15:18] coat hanger syndrome it's called that was actually my big symptom was it was a lot in my arms as my
[00:15:23] hands would swell so it can be different parts of your body too but those are some of the main
[00:15:28] symptoms yeah and sometimes that can be scary I mean I experienced that I remember the first
[00:15:33] time well I'd had multiple times where I'd stand up and be a little lightheaded or something
[00:15:38] like that but then a couple times where it was like I couldn't it didn't relieve right the
[00:15:44] for after a few seconds but it's scary at first and then I think when we get so scared in those
[00:15:49] states then it stresses our nervous system out anymore even more and it just kind of
[00:15:54] perpetuates this cycle and I think you mentioned you know some of these things happen
[00:15:59] after a virus but also in conjunction with just stress in life environmental personal
[00:16:04] all kinds of things which yeah stress can lock that nervous system so then along your journey
[00:16:12] and training how did you come to understand what working with the nervous system really looked like
[00:16:18] or like why did you need to start working with the nervous system that's a great question I have
[00:16:23] always been someone that is probably more on the ADD spectrum I think a lot of us with this
[00:16:31] maybe cluster of symptoms are not always pretty pretty like sensitive to input person I think a
[00:16:36] lot of us have what I believe now is vagus nerve sensitivity is a big connection point between
[00:16:41] EDS POTS, master log activation as you heard of that and ADD they're finding so basically your
[00:16:48] vagus nerve is the kind of like you know the the master controller a lot of people would say
[00:16:53] at least the regulator of that autonomic nervous system so it's the biggest longest nerve in
[00:16:58] your body and goes from right here I can't see me but right behind the ears comes out of the brain
[00:17:03] right behind the ears travels down the neck all through the chest and into a lot of the organs
[00:17:08] has a little bit of output to the ears and input to the ears and controls your breath but
[00:17:13] truly is like the rest and digest nerve of the body and it controls how we take in input
[00:17:22] and they've shown with all those populations that oftentimes the vagus nerve is just maybe
[00:17:26] a little bit more prone to getting under reactive or over reactive so all of a sudden like
[00:17:31] taking in input is like you can get really overwhelmed with sensory input or with sound
[00:17:37] the vagus nerve controls little inner ear muscles the controller how we interpret sound
[00:17:41] controls blood vessels I remember even when I was little I was like I would be running and
[00:17:45] would pass out if I checked if I worked too hard and stuff like that that I thought was
[00:17:48] normal but wasn't and so I guess I just kind of lived in this very scattered state is what
[00:17:53] I'm getting to for a really long time and kind of state of hyper arousal so I was my vagus nerve
[00:18:00] was probably a little low and I was kind of living off the fight or flight response and
[00:18:05] then at some point probably when all that happened I kind of crashed and even that
[00:18:09] fight or flight response gave out and I fell into what I believe is a freeze response
[00:18:15] so there's something called the polyvagal theory is that something y'all you've talked
[00:18:18] about on the podcast some a little bit but let's you can explain it it's in my program but not
[00:18:24] everyone here knows it okay awesome new new theory about the autonomic nervous system but
[00:18:30] basically instead of the seesaw between fight or flight and rest and digest and like you go
[00:18:34] back and forth it's explaining it as you it's a three-prong ladder and the top of the ladder
[00:18:40] is that like true like parasympathetic connected calm but present state that we want to live a
[00:18:46] lot of our life in no one lives there all the time you always have stressors that come up but
[00:18:49] it's like the most ideal place to live that's going to increase your longevity and happiness in life
[00:18:55] next rung of the ladder down is that fight or flight nervous system which gets a bad rap but
[00:19:00] it's also like our energy system and our you know there's times that we want to have that
[00:19:05] slight fight or flight response like you get scared in an alley you need to get out of there
[00:19:09] or you need to respond suddenly to something or you're in a sports game and it's a fun
[00:19:13] like sympathetic like you need your heart rate up you need your body more responsive so there's a good
[00:19:17] time but if it's there and overworked for too long then we fall like even that fight or flight
[00:19:24] systems like I can't do this anymore you're relying on me too much or if you have a trauma
[00:19:28] that happens this can happen too and you fall down to the bottom rung of the ladder which is
[00:19:32] like the freeze response and this is how I explain it I'm sure I'm not doing this perfectly
[00:19:36] but freeze response is really more of just like it can kind of mimic the top of the ladder
[00:19:41] because you seem calm but it's more like a disconnected calm typically can be associated
[00:19:46] with depression or fatigue with slowed digestion often not increased digestion and with often like
[00:19:55] cold extremities and just like the sense of just being out of it and I think it's so key
[00:20:00] because to get back to your question about like when I found this was key when I really got bad
[00:20:05] I think I was living in that freeze state a lot of the time and it was a teacher that got me on to
[00:20:14] a meditation training program that wasn't just mindfulness it was it was a true like a distinguish
[00:20:20] between mindfulness meditation and manifesting and it was like this really robust thing but it
[00:20:25] wasn't just geared toward hey let's just get your anxiety down it was like how do we restore
[00:20:29] your energy system how do we get you out of the freeze out of the bottom and I was really skeptical
[00:20:36] and it was really hard because it was a lot of sitting there in silence like it's true meditation I
[00:20:40] believe is more of like a mantra word and trying to still your mind and watch the thoughts float by
[00:20:46] rather than just focusing on your body sensations and your breath but through doing that I started
[00:20:52] that was one of my steps up the ladder I guess to getting better and I started to notice
[00:20:56] like I could take in more input and colors were brighter and I was happier and I was more connected
[00:21:02] but it took doing that and then doing little exercise but exercise geared toward the nervous
[00:21:08] system and like getting that sympathetic response turned back on in a healthy way that's what let
[00:21:12] me actually feel like I was present and connected and could like be the best version of myself
[00:21:17] for the people around me again and gave me the brain energy to even think about what I needed
[00:21:22] to do physically to get better and stronger we don't often talk about the the three different
[00:21:30] parts of the ladder if you will for probably bagel theory language but oftentimes when you're in
[00:21:36] that freeze I usually call the shutdown response especially when we're working with chronic
[00:21:40] fatigue people and brain fog and migraines that's where you're going to live in that
[00:21:44] shutdown right and sometimes we have to go through the the the middle part the yellow
[00:21:51] if you will to get to the green right and sometimes that means really getting up into the
[00:21:56] the fight or flight a little bit you might move through that to get to the call center and we don't
[00:22:00] recognize that we're gonna kind of go back and forth for a little bit you mentioned you said
[00:22:06] I started to learn tools to help me healthily get back into the parasympathetic right so what
[00:22:12] exactly does that mean what's the difference between you know tools that can help you get
[00:22:16] there in a healthy way versus not I think the unhealthy way for me was just these ways
[00:22:20] that didn't work and just devolve them to a lot of shame because I was like why can't this doesn't
[00:22:24] work for me why can't I get to where these people are and I think shame is a big you know
[00:22:30] there's everyone has different things that work for them and shame is the biggest
[00:22:34] block to us getting better and everyone is different for me I think my body was in that
[00:22:40] freeze and it would try to do these kind of unhealthy like I'd be like ashamed myself and
[00:22:45] be like you have to get up out of bed do this thing and I'd get this like I'd use guilt
[00:22:49] as my motivator and then I'd come out and I'd have like basically an anxiety attack
[00:22:53] and I'd be like okay no going back down and shutting down and so it was just like yo yo like
[00:22:57] you said and for me it was like okay can I just do a couple little jumping jacks or like some floor
[00:23:04] jacks or can I just go on a little walk or love on my dog but in a way that gets my energy
[00:23:09] system up and gets me a little bit into that amp state but not anxious or if I feel the
[00:23:14] anxiety coming on can I be like oh yay that's energy instead of oh no that's anxiety and just
[00:23:19] see if I can once I feel it turn it into something that's like okay anxiety isn't up it's energy now
[00:23:25] I can turn it and for me it was like regulating caffeine a little bit too like I think I was
[00:23:29] just using caffeine and stimulants to to do the up and then it was leading to anxiety so it
[00:23:33] was like how can I get to that without that so like cold showers have been the key for me at
[00:23:37] times when it's bad that's not everyone's cup of tea but like how can I stimulate the
[00:23:42] the nerve system very few people get out of cold shower and have an anxiety attack but it's very
[00:23:47] sympathetic inducing it turns on that it increases your blood pressure it helps you regulate
[00:23:52] wim hoff breathing if you've heard of that was actually one that was helpful for me that's just
[00:23:56] like a a breath technique focused on the inhale and is very I feel very energized after I do one
[00:24:03] of those and I have patients that can't tolerate that but for those of you listening it's
[00:24:06] definitely one worth trying and maybe building up to is wim hoff breathing is great there's
[00:24:11] tons of videos out there and he tends to be the big proponent of cold showers as well
[00:24:15] the man seems to be able to completely consciously control his autonomic nervous system in a really
[00:24:21] crazy way and says he can train other people to do it it's really fascinating but in the end of the
[00:24:26] day that's what we're trying to learn to do with pots is like how can we how can we figure out
[00:24:30] hacks to use our body and our brain to get back and control this subconscious nervous system
[00:24:38] and I'll go ahead and link those few different things we mentioned but down below as well wim
[00:24:42] hoff and there was one other that I'll link there that I just forgot that I'll make sure it's there
[00:24:48] okay so I I really actually like that you acknowledge the place from where we do these
[00:24:53] things is so important if we're coming from a shame or fear-based place and forcing ourselves
[00:24:57] to do these things it's going to stress us out more it's going to create more shame and more
[00:25:02] guilt and it's going to shut you down it's just going to become that cycle we talk about
[00:25:07] this so I talked about this so often with my clients like truly the intention behind what you're
[00:25:12] doing even if it looks the same at least mostly the same truly matters and it shapes actually
[00:25:20] the process of the tool or the practice whether that's a mental practice a physical practice
[00:25:25] it can change how you do it so yeah when we're in a shame spiral and cycle and keeps us stuck
[00:25:31] it actually keeps us sick sometimes there's have you ever read gabore maté's book scattered
[00:25:36] minds I've read other ones but not that one yet I've heard great things so that's so good yeah
[00:25:41] I really get audible on google play the one on audible is not as good but it's been really amazing for
[00:25:46] me for the 80d but he talks a ton about shame I guess is where I'm getting at and just like how
[00:25:51] like from a psychological perspective if you're interested like what parts of the brain it
[00:25:55] shuts down and how shame is like part of the the process that can lead into 80d as well
[00:26:01] and so like to truly if you want to try to heal 80d which he believes is possible at least to an extent
[00:26:07] the a lot of it is shame resilience and like the parts of yourself that are stuck in that like
[00:26:12] two-year-old mentality of when when that when they got segmented so it's like kind of parts work
[00:26:18] meets psychology meets gabore maté who's just awesome and has great he's just cool he kind of
[00:26:24] has his fingers in so many different pots and talks in so great such great ways but
[00:26:27] he has severe 80d himself and so to see someone so successful that can speak to the growth he's had
[00:26:34] and is not against medication he uses it some himself but like to hear him talk about that
[00:26:38] balance is great but sorry I just segmented because you talked about shame and it helped me
[00:26:43] I am a still have that engineering brain so sometimes I have to have a physical reason
[00:26:49] for something and then it helps me completely like buy in with my lifestyle to like a why
[00:26:54] it's important to not have shame is like oh you really can't form new pathways if you have shame
[00:27:00] there like it's it goes against them you're not in the right mental state to do so so you're you're
[00:27:05] trying to sit there and be like why can't I form a new habit why can't I do this stuff and
[00:27:09] if shames in the room it's really hard no that's actually I mean it's very helpful
[00:27:12] because everyone needs different motivations to be able to do some of this but
[00:27:17] um yeah any type of like mental physical or just in general psycho education can be helpful to just at
[00:27:24] least if you can understand it if you can become aware of your body signals what's going on in your
[00:27:29] brain what's going on in your body then we can help you work through that or use tools that
[00:27:35] are going to help you and you're going to be more motivated because you understand what's going
[00:27:39] on so awareness is huge so definitely I and love Gabor Matei I yeah reference him all the time
[00:27:47] and all like his stuff too okay I'm gonna back up a minute because I want to talk about the biggest
[00:27:52] nerve and biggest nerve practices because you work really well with this and you mentioned
[00:27:57] that's something you recognized in understanding the nervous system I know when I saw you and
[00:28:02] I would come in I had some understanding of it when I came to see you but I didn't
[00:28:08] I hadn't started this program yet I hadn't this wasn't fully my niche yet and
[00:28:12] you would do a few different biggest nerve activation techniques on me and I remember
[00:28:16] leaving there and I literally was like my brain fogs gone my fatigue is gone what's
[00:28:20] happened what just happened I can you know I walk in dreading or just feeling so heavy
[00:28:26] in my body and I recognize that I was needing that activation so can you speak to why that
[00:28:32] helps and those certain tools that you use definitely so the autonomic nervous system
[00:28:39] that we're talking about that's involved with either sandless syndrome and dysautonomia
[00:28:44] it is automatic but there are physical things in your body that are causing it to let us hack
[00:28:49] back in so breath is a super common one I always love breath because it's truly is like
[00:28:55] internal and external but it's also like it's the autonomic and we can manually force a breath
[00:29:01] and then through that hack back into our subconscious autonomic nervous system so in the same way
[00:29:08] from a physical standpoint I studied a lot about where those nervous systems lie in our body
[00:29:14] and where the regulators of those nervous systems lie in our body so the the vagus nerve
[00:29:20] like I said comes from here the polyvagal theory would say that the right and the
[00:29:24] vagus nerve actually right and left vagus nerve have slightly different roles as well
[00:29:29] so I will like test in clinic which one might be working better worse for someone by just how
[00:29:34] much the back of their throat raises and how tight it is and things like that but
[00:29:38] basically can we can we free up the pathway is something I'll work on manually so just a lot
[00:29:44] of people with these conditions feel really good after body work certain types of body work and
[00:29:49] I think part of that is you're truly like freeing up the pathway of the vagus nerve
[00:29:52] can you make sure your upper cervical neck is in alignment upper cervical chiropractic can
[00:29:57] be a really helpful really gentle technique that's good for eds with that and can you free up the
[00:30:04] path along the chest and do some like gentle like self bowel massage of the organs is a really good
[00:30:10] vagus stimulator that we could talk about in a minute breath exercises were my first thing I
[00:30:15] very learned about the vagus nerve so how can we turn that rest and digest system back on
[00:30:20] the most researched one last I checked was that works for the most people everyone's
[00:30:25] different is like four six eight breath so can you inhale for four hold for six exhale for eight
[00:30:32] super simple I'll tell people do it every time you go to the bathroom or start your car or how can
[00:30:36] you make that part of your day if you're someone especially lives in the fight or flight mode
[00:30:41] so that you know you're having that input back into your body to say hey it's safe we don't
[00:30:46] need to be here like can we can we rest can we digest can we focus our energy on something
[00:30:51] else and just breathing is really cool especially if you can focus on breathing through the lower part
[00:30:57] of your rib cage that's where your diaphragm lives and rather than breathing up through your neck
[00:31:03] so that's one of the tools that I give to people sometimes I'll have them lay down and put their
[00:31:07] hand on that like like bottom of the rib cage and right of your stomach and can you
[00:31:12] as you breathe in can you picture inhale for four and feel that expansion up feel your hand
[00:31:19] lift toward the ceiling this is someone laying on their back and can they also feel their back
[00:31:22] push into the the surface behind them so 3d breath can you hold for six and then can you
[00:31:28] exhale for eight and I've heard a lot of people and myself do better even working up toward a longer
[00:31:33] exhale so like a you know a 10 and then a 15 second exhale just if I really need quick amounts
[00:31:40] of high dose calm that really helps me still my life back every day so breath work is huge
[00:31:46] and there's so many avenues out there for it that work for people and whether those are spiritual
[00:31:50] practices or just physical practices kundalini yoga wimhoff like we already mentioned or just that
[00:31:57] simple four six eight so easy then let's see there's something called the basic vagus nerve
[00:32:03] exercise is that something I've gone over before in the podcast not in the podcast now
[00:32:08] but yeah so this was created pretty recently I believe by the same team that created the
[00:32:13] polyvagal theory kind of realized why this happens or how it happens I'm not sure there's
[00:32:18] think there's some debate on the why but there's a super simple exercise you can do that is more
[00:32:23] I believe physically freeing up the vagus nerve so like I talked about it comes out from the back
[00:32:27] of your neck and our bodies are all connected so if y'all who are listening want to follow
[00:32:33] along this is an exercise you can do that really helps to free up both the vagus and the
[00:32:38] glossopharyngeal nerve that help with swallowing but a lot of times while people are doing it
[00:32:42] they'll feel less headache tension less neck tension and actually get some stomach gurgles
[00:32:47] that's a sign of that digestion turning back on so you can do this either sitting back in a chair
[00:32:52] but where your head can be rested on something or you can lay down on the floor I tend to recommend
[00:32:57] lay down on the floor the first time and you have your hands laced behind your head if that's
[00:33:02] comfortable for your shoulders and your neck's just resting kind of drawn a little long so the
[00:33:07] back of your neck is free then you're going to keep your head completely still that's really
[00:33:12] why your hands are there to make sure your head doesn't turn because most people want to turn their head
[00:33:16] and you just bring only your eyes as far as you can to the right doesn't matter which way
[00:33:21] you're first but let's start with the right and you hold them there until you get a yawn
[00:33:26] sigh or sneeze response and as I am doing this and talking to y'all I'll tell you a little
[00:33:31] bit about why that happens so you'll hold it there till you get the response what they
[00:33:36] believe is happening is that your eyes are probably your eye muscles go through the sphenoid bone which
[00:33:42] is the bone right in the middle your skull and it's really interconnected with the upper cervical
[00:33:48] so you're actually creating a little bit of rotation and balance between those and when
[00:33:53] they open up just enough that the vagus nerve gets more blood flow it creates that shift into
[00:33:57] just like you know or or a desire to sneeze or sigh if you ever notice that sneezes are
[00:34:03] contagious that's because there's this kind of shift into parasympathetic in the room
[00:34:07] sometimes people don't get that response after a minute and a half or two minutes but most of the
[00:34:11] time they do if they if you don't just it's probably a little stiff on that side and stuck
[00:34:16] so just at the end of it keep your eyes to the right let yourself take a big sigh breathe in out
[00:34:22] once you're done with that bring your eyes back to the middle settle for a second and then
[00:34:26] you'll repeat over to the left and so we don't have to go through the whole rest of that
[00:34:31] now but you'll hold to the left until you go on size sneeze oftentimes you'll find one direction
[00:34:36] is a lot easier than the other and you can start with that direction in the future and that might
[00:34:40] help the other direction go easier but they've actually shown on images that the upper cervical
[00:34:45] I'm sorry I'm saying C1 but that is your top cervical vertebrae so your top neck vertebra
[00:34:50] actually changes alignment a little bit there and the bottom of your brain rests right there
[00:34:55] at the base of your skull and that whole balance system rests right there and everything so
[00:34:59] if you can free that up you're gonna get better blood flowing around your brain
[00:35:03] you're gonna have better blood pressure regulation in your body and you're gonna get more of that
[00:35:07] vagus nerve balance so I love that exercise and that's what I'm gonna go to is I teach people
[00:35:11] right away really great to do right before you go to bed as well just make sure if you're
[00:35:15] doing it you're not like heads not cranked up on a pillow you want to be pretty flat in bed
[00:35:19] but it really helps if any of y'all struggle with insomnia just really puts you in a great
[00:35:24] mental peaceful state to go to bed and then so those are the vagus nerve exercises some a few
[00:35:30] that I teach but I really don't like to talk about them in a nutshell because I think the
[00:35:33] vagus nerve is harped on and harped on but I think it's only half that puzzle like I was talking
[00:35:37] about so a lot of the exercises that I like to give and the advice I give people I do a lot of
[00:35:42] virtual talks with people from around the country is just how can we also activate and reset
[00:35:49] and love on that sympathetic nervous system and the sympathetic nervous system lives actually in the
[00:35:55] middle of our back so like from kind of your collarbone area down to the bottom of your rib cage so
[00:36:00] we call that a thoracic spine and the sympathetic nervous system lives right on the underside of
[00:36:06] the spine so toward the back of the body and it's these little bitty ganglia there and they're
[00:36:10] basically the can I increase your heart rate can I increase your blood pressure which someone
[00:36:14] of us have a low blood pressure right there they're the the little nerves that help regulate that system
[00:36:20] and who knows exactly what the overlap is there's all these different theories maybe it's the
[00:36:25] vagus nerve but maybe it's a physical restriction too like people with hypermobility are more prone
[00:36:29] to actually having like tightened thickened fascia around their organs so like maybe
[00:36:34] there's a physical restriction happening in that thoracic cage that's creating some just
[00:36:38] I don't know me of people you know my other theory is that a lot of us lock our knees
[00:36:42] and we're actually preventing some of that blood flow from coming back up because they
[00:36:45] have to come up behind the knees and maybe that's some of the connection between hypermobility
[00:36:49] and POTS so if you're out there in your hypermobile stop locking your knees maybe try a little strip
[00:36:54] of KT tape behind your knees so you can't totally straighten them and that can be really
[00:36:58] helpful for POTS but I digress so yes exercise for the sympathetic nervous system
[00:37:04] there's one called the salamander that that same institute came out with it's basically
[00:37:08] you can google it salamander exercise and there's different ways but it's like I think it's similar
[00:37:14] to when you stretch in the morning you get that like ringing out sensation of your spinal cord
[00:37:18] it's kind of like that then it's just like can you twist and shake your thoracic spine
[00:37:23] so I was just on a virtual with a patient right before this and she was like telling me she's
[00:37:27] like oh my gosh that makes so much sense to me because the way I increase my blood pressure is
[00:37:31] just flapping my arms around and like wiggling a lot and she's like I always feel so crazy
[00:37:36] but it's like how I live my life and don't pass out all the time and I just thought that was so
[00:37:40] cute but I told her the reason I thought why was because she's every time you move your arms if
[00:37:44] you just do a big wave pattern you can feel that thoracic spine bending and twisting and
[00:37:48] getting really great blood flow so it's like can you just activate it that way just through
[00:37:52] movement and through getting a little bit excited and having fun with it it kind of
[00:37:56] throws that shame out of the room a little bit and makes it all a little bit more lighthearted
[00:38:01] one of my favorites is just like a really simple like can you curl your spine downward in a seated
[00:38:06] position and vertebrae vertebrae extend up in a comfortable range never painful and think about
[00:38:12] just like breathing into and allowing blood flow up and down the spine and then I teach like thoracic
[00:38:18] twists exercises for people and there's some different ones that are a little more complex
[00:38:21] that I'd have to get into if people are actually like a patient doing virtual with me but
[00:38:25] there's lots of different situations is my point and sometimes just a little bit
[00:38:28] thoracic activation you know I think swimming strokes if that's in your toolbox is great
[00:38:33] like a freestyle because you're getting you're getting that thoracic activation so
[00:38:37] but you don't need doing it for that long it can truly be 30 seconds and it makes a
[00:38:41] big difference for people and that's really cool and if you don't believe me get a blood
[00:38:44] pressure cuff out in a heart rate monitor and test before after and you might be really
[00:38:48] surprised by what you find there a lot of us have enough blood in our body our body just
[00:38:53] doesn't think we have enough blood and so we live in that like less not everyone some people
[00:38:57] are hypertensive so they have too much blood too much blood pressure but a lot of us are
[00:39:01] hypotensive so too little blood pressure and it's just about how do we get the blood to the right
[00:39:06] place and how do we convince our body that the blood is in the right place because it doesn't
[00:39:10] think we are we have enough blood so then it increases your heart rate and then that that's
[00:39:15] often what kind of leads to the fatigue and the feelings of anxiety and so how can you
[00:39:20] convince your body there's enough blood flow and how can you move it around more successfully so
[00:39:23] those are some of my little tricks I put one of the thoracic spine activation or
[00:39:28] sympathetic activation exercises in my program because it again that was one that you don't
[00:39:33] you don't hear about the difference between those we hear a lot about the eye movement
[00:39:37] or a little bit of like gentle massage around the neck upper upper body upper shoulders
[00:39:42] but not as much of that like thoracic activation like you were just talking about
[00:39:46] so super powerful because again there are differences right and what might work for
[00:39:52] someone doesn't always work for someone else actually even the eye movement one
[00:39:56] for the longest time I would I wouldn't have a yawn or reaction or anything nothing would happen
[00:40:01] until I remember one day doing it being like oh there it is and I just kept doing it because
[00:40:09] like I understand the reason behind it so I wanted you know I wanted to do it wanted to
[00:40:13] but just yeah everybody's everybody's body is different I think to your point about like
[00:40:19] trying things and having a list and sticking with them big big thing I tend to advise for people is
[00:40:25] like just when we're in a brain foggy collapse state trying to remember do any of this is hard so
[00:40:30] be nice to yourself and create a list write it down have tools have someone that's there
[00:40:35] like I have patients that just call me and are like hey what are my things to do and I will
[00:40:39] tell them you know but I also tell them write it down and have like your emergency
[00:40:43] response list for shutdown you know and maybe it's this much water these supplements this
[00:40:49] this exercise and it's never going to be the same every day either but a lot of times
[00:40:54] you can find things that work so just wanted to wanted to say that what you're talking
[00:40:57] and reminded me of that just a lot of people think it's like not necessary to write things
[00:41:01] down they shouldn't need it and should is such an awful word in that case period but there's
[00:41:06] completely fine to rely on a list yeah and we need different we need it readily accessible
[00:41:10] because again like you said in those teak shutdown or even high anxiety places we actually don't have
[00:41:15] access to our prefrontal cortex which makes us critically think like we we can't just
[00:41:21] grab on to what we already know our brains are not there it's it's shut down so we need help
[00:41:26] yeah and they end to your point routines and things that help you are not going to be the
[00:41:31] exact same every day forever my routine and what helps me shifts all the time based on what
[00:41:35] i'm doing or what's going on in my life so yeah but figuring out what to do is
[00:41:41] often a massive amount of energy that we don't really it's not physical energy so we don't think
[00:41:45] about it but conserving energy is the name of the game when we're in a certain place in life so
[00:41:51] how can we minimize how much decision making we have to do yeah definitely okay so we've talked
[00:41:58] about we've talked about a few different physical practices which has been really
[00:42:02] helpful i love having practices we can do what what do you think has helped you or maybe what
[00:42:09] helps your patients the most the most when you're working with both the mind and body connection
[00:42:16] that's a great question i guess i like to start by teaching that they're they're not as separate
[00:42:21] as we think that we can have those like physical exercises we do that help the mental and that
[00:42:25] that's not saying well and and that there is a difference between physical anxiety and maybe
[00:42:32] mental anxiety is the right word just purely psychological anxiety is probably the best word
[00:42:37] psychosomatic anxiety versus psychological anxiety like those feel different and a lot of us have been
[00:42:41] told oh just be less anxious or let's just do talk therapy and figure out why you're anxious
[00:42:46] and if you have something physical going on that is truly like your vagus nerve is not on
[00:42:52] far as much and you're living in like a sympathetic state that's not going to be that easy so you have
[00:42:57] to address it from both sides and to give yourself that grace as far as the mind body
[00:43:01] connection goes i find a lot of my clients and and myself when i was going through a really hard
[00:43:06] time we're kind of disconnected from our bodies they don't feel very fun all the time
[00:43:11] and very strong and so but they are you know and i don't think being bendy is
[00:43:17] in and of itself a bad thing like when we're little we can always probably a lot of us can
[00:43:23] remember a time when we were bendy and it felt great and it was reflexive and strong and some
[00:43:27] of the best athletes in the world are super hypermobile and strong and it in and of itself
[00:43:31] can be a superpower because it tends to me where we're you know we're more empathetic or more
[00:43:36] sensitive to life input but also tend to be great leaders and great healers i try to
[00:43:41] help people feel a little bit more at home in their body and some of that's just
[00:43:44] they're talking through things like that i do a lot of once we kind of get past the
[00:43:49] first few days of education if someone's coming with me in person or even over virtual
[00:43:53] have them put their hands on themselves but like what does this area feel like in your mind
[00:43:58] or in your body and like how can you kind of love on the area a little bit more and you know
[00:44:02] part of my training is in like more somatic healing so if someone's had a trauma or
[00:44:07] someone you know the body keeps the score so regardless of whether you've had any
[00:44:11] single point trauma our body can hold on to energy to emotion to different things the organs
[00:44:17] especially love to hold on to emotion so it's like can you honor those emotions and thank your body
[00:44:22] for holding on to those things ask it if it can let those emotions go now and when that happens
[00:44:27] a lot of times if you can just really hear your body open up your mind be able to really feel
[00:44:32] the things it's feeling maybe it's fear fear fear anger anger and let yourself feel it
[00:44:36] in a non-judgmental way and then let it pass a lot of times the physical tension associated
[00:44:41] might change go away maybe become something that's much more tangible like oh now it's just a single
[00:44:48] trigger point we free that up and we're good so yeah I think that that's a lot of what I try to do
[00:44:53] is just get people back connected and feeling strong in their body again and I guess one other
[00:44:58] thing I'd like to mention there is grounding and toning work have been big from both the
[00:45:03] mental and physical point of view so yes our body itself might be a little bit less stable
[00:45:08] and I think you can do a lot of exercises to build stability you can build your vestibular nervous
[00:45:13] system backup like I said and it's amazing how no strength training needed that makes people feel
[00:45:18] stronger because their body knows where it's at in space but a lot of us forget and are kind of
[00:45:24] disconnected with the very stable forces around us mostly being the grounds like the ground is
[00:45:30] very very stable walls are very stable desks are very stable so can you learn to pull energy
[00:45:35] up through the surfaces around you and that is I think a lot more how we were we've evolved like for
[00:45:41] a long time regardless of sometimes it does feel really great to go out and ground truly in the
[00:45:47] earth I think there's something with the magnetic pull of the earth that is how we
[00:45:51] evolve for a long time but I don't think that's necessary all the time either it can just be
[00:45:54] the ground and can you root through the ground and picture that ground energy coming up and
[00:45:58] supporting your organs from the inside we haven't gotten that much but organ therapy is a lot
[00:46:02] of what I love to do in person and you know supporting your joints so you're not just hanging
[00:46:07] on your joints can you have the ground actually supporting them and be supporting them yourself
[00:46:12] and feel that power through the ground so that tends to be mentally calming too is my point
[00:46:16] whatever your spiritual or you know meditation practices are I think that can fit into a lot
[00:46:20] of a lot of them in full ways for me like I'm Christian and I can let it kind of combine
[00:46:24] it in some really cool ways with like a prayer and the grounding technique that I do every day
[00:46:28] that just helps me to feel calmer spiritually psychologically and physically stronger so
[00:46:36] things like that are really great so then I mean you're right there's there are so many ways to
[00:46:41] connect your mind and body the point being to really well become more aware of what's going on
[00:46:47] and how we can tune into our bodies because again if we can be with what's going on underneath
[00:46:52] the surface we can learn how to help ourselves through support and tools and things like that
[00:46:58] right but we cannot cut them off so one thing I've talked about on here and that I talked about
[00:47:02] with a lot of people is if you're going down the physical route and most of you listening probably
[00:47:07] are you've done all different and all different kinds of treatments in the physical realm and
[00:47:13] more often than not we get to a point where we recognize that's not the only it's not working
[00:47:19] we're at least not fully working and we do have to look at what's going on and mentally
[00:47:24] emotionally spiritually like how do we combine all that together because that's who we are that's
[00:47:28] the whole of who we are we are not one or the other we're everything and it all affects each
[00:47:33] other do you notice that people end up coming to you physically first and then you go down
[00:47:41] that route of addressing mentally emotionally does it all go together yeah that's spot on
[00:47:46] grace that's been I think that's been my learning path as a practitioner I think I came
[00:47:52] to it on a personal level and it took me it's taking me a while to figure out how to
[00:47:57] get people there as my patients but yeah I think a lot of us come to a person to a provider looking
[00:48:05] for a single thing and sometimes that's all we can feel like we can handle at one point time is
[00:48:10] like I want physical help with this thing that is keeping me from doing this thing or I want
[00:48:15] mental health with this thing and often not always but I feel like the truth if
[00:48:20] of what you're saying is like you have to address them all and I think the timing of it
[00:48:25] unfortunately matters too which is hard it's like sometimes we want to just be like oh I just
[00:48:31] want to dig down to the roots of this one thing right now and I really love the analogy of like
[00:48:36] sometimes when I was getting better it was like I was digging from one side and then there was
[00:48:40] just like dirt falling in the hole from the other sides and regardless of the pace you
[00:48:44] can do it's like I think you kind of have to dig from all sides at once at whatever pace you
[00:48:49] can handle but not not leave the others behind or else you just end up with dirt pouring in so
[00:48:55] to your question would people come in sometimes I want to have a note on the door that's just like
[00:49:00] are you ready to heal do you want to be that's aggressive that's not that's not the point but
[00:49:04] my point as as a practitioner I think it is part of our job to help like help figure out the
[00:49:09] different barriers to people getting there and it's never just physical you know sometimes it's
[00:49:13] can you how do you need to change your home environment sometimes it's it's just yeah
[00:49:18] meditation training but a lot of times I feel like it's almost more of an identity thing I the
[00:49:24] concept of manifesting has been really helpful for me and I try to teach patients that like day one
[00:49:29] if they're open to it I think the word itself has gotten a bit of a weird wrap sometimes but
[00:49:35] I believe that a lot of this cluster of conditions is like epigenetic that's my opinion
[00:49:42] but meaning we have a genetic predisposition to a thing and then there's certain
[00:49:46] circumstances in life that turn it on these genes that cause a lot of issues but I think
[00:49:51] through the right sets of support and circumstances and growth something our body is
[00:49:56] trying to teach us I try to see it as like a helpful journey that's going to make us stronger
[00:50:00] we can turn a lot of those genes back off sometimes a lot of the time and but we have to
[00:50:07] have our subconscious has to have a direction and if we identify overly as someone who is
[00:50:12] who is who is broken who is weak who is unstable and that is your identity at your deepest level
[00:50:17] then like your subconscious whether it's the autonomic nervous system or something even deeper
[00:50:21] parts of the brain your olympic system your your little proteins in yourselves like they
[00:50:25] don't know they're supposed to do anything different because that's who you are so from
[00:50:29] a manifesting standpoint can you go to bed at night this is just the most powerful time
[00:50:34] they've shown psychologically to manifest is right as you're like about to fall asleep or
[00:50:38] right after the end of a good meditation right when you first wake up our conscious brain is like
[00:50:43] kind of taking a back seat or subconscious is more there so can you picture what your life would be
[00:50:48] like without any of this condition as if it's your present reality and a lot of times the answer
[00:50:54] at first is like no I can't picture it or I can picture it in this way but I can't picture what
[00:50:57] it's like to not have to worry about this pain at least that was the answer for me is it took
[00:51:02] me a long time to come up with a code for my life or I was like I've had this chronic right
[00:51:06] pain ever since I had this surgery that I had to have done thoracic outlet syndrome surgery and
[00:51:11] I realized I didn't have a path I didn't have a way in my brain for it not to exist I couldn't imagine
[00:51:16] a day where I wasn't worried about it and it wasn't until I could imagine that day pictured as
[00:51:20] my current reality that finally like a few days later like something can be oh I should try to
[00:51:25] treat scar tissue in my bicep or oh I should try to do a stretch like this that shouldn't
[00:51:30] have been anywhere the surgery affected but it helped so it's like then your brain's like
[00:51:33] oh that's what you want I got you and I think that's what happened so I guess yes that's what
[00:51:39] I try to tie in and that you know I tell people like that's not work I can do but I think it's
[00:51:44] really important yeah it's huge use there's a lot of identity work when you're going down this route
[00:51:50] and healing chronic symptoms because most likely it's just become such a big part of your life that
[00:51:56] how could it not be a big part of your identity so separating that is a really big really big
[00:52:00] thing that we work on with people as well yeah for sure yeah and there's a time when you need it
[00:52:05] because you're like need the validation of like I'm not crazy I really am hurting
[00:52:09] and how do you how do you honor that part and be like you're right yes and you know that's not
[00:52:16] all of who I am exactly this could be a whole other episode and probably will be actually
[00:52:22] yes so okay well last well two last two more questions one what do you want people to know
[00:52:30] when about having we didn't use this term but I really like it the invisible illness right so like
[00:52:36] any kind of chronic symptoms chronic pain hyperobility eds things that like yeah from the
[00:52:43] outside eye people don't recognize you are sick but we're really really struggling inside
[00:52:48] what do you want people to know if they're struggling with this maybe they're beginning
[00:52:52] their journey you get to be your own advocate I don't like to even say have to be your own
[00:52:56] advocate you get to become your own advocate and that sucks at times but I think it's empowering
[00:53:02] and others and I'm not telling everyone to go around and be Dr. Google because that's dangerous too
[00:53:08] but I think that distinguishing fact verse truth understanding that there can be glimpses of
[00:53:14] truth in a lot of what you hear maybe it's a glimpse of truth in a Facebook feed but then
[00:53:19] you know taking away some of the stuff that may be more like inflammatory to your story or
[00:53:23] like kind of negative and you know maybe a glimpse of truth from this doctor and oh this
[00:53:29] really resounds from this doctor and oh I read this this research article that said this and so
[00:53:34] you get to put it all together yourself and it doesn't matter it matters but it doesn't
[00:53:40] matter as much if a doctor is willing to put that diagnosis on you or is willing to
[00:53:46] it treats you a certain way because of it doctors aren't super humans or perfect and I
[00:53:50] think mourning and accepting that has been a big thing for me and if some of them don't treat you
[00:53:55] well because they don't believe you or whatever that has nothing to do with you that is their
[00:54:00] limitations and their problems and they're doing the best they can treating a very different set of
[00:54:05] conditions probably and they can just help out one little thing you do so I think just don't
[00:54:08] let other people define you and if you don't feel shame about it and you're open about it
[00:54:13] I think that really helps like when I first had an invisible condition I found that like
[00:54:19] it was like there was a part of me that was just like trying to hide it and there's another part
[00:54:22] that was like screaming like can't you see I'm hurting can't you see I'm hurting and I think
[00:54:27] that's okay at first and then I think you kind of move through you know every time I travel now
[00:54:32] I travel with this really big suitcase because I have to have my supplies around in case I get a
[00:54:37] flare up of this or my joint goes out of place and I need to KT tape it and I used to have
[00:54:41] a lot of shame around that and I'd kind of try to hide it or I'd try to spend like
[00:54:45] eight hours of my night like packing into this tiny suitcase that I couldn't really fit in and
[00:54:48] it's just like can you just own that this is where you're at at this point in life and not have
[00:54:53] shame around it and be open about it and then you'd be shocked by like if you do that other
[00:54:57] people don't see it as a disability or they really honor where you're at if you don't see
[00:55:02] that but if you come into the room and you're like oh I'm embarrassed in my big suitcase
[00:55:05] like I used to be people look at it more it's like you're inviting that subconsciously so
[00:55:10] I just think really playing with like knowing that what you're thinking about subconsciously
[00:55:13] where you're holding matters you do have there is something under the surface that's very true
[00:55:19] but you're never going to get the validation from the outside that you want even though we deserve it
[00:55:24] but you can validate that to yourself if that and I think that helps other people understand
[00:55:29] so consciously if that made any sense in a roundabout way. It definitely did thank you so
[00:55:33] much for saying that especially the piece of being able to advocate for yourself and not
[00:55:37] taking everything as truth right one doctor says something doesn't always mean that's exactly
[00:55:43] what you need and everything that's going to fix you or not fix you if they don't believe it can
[00:55:48] right so there's just there's so much out there and the more that you can empower yourself
[00:55:53] and advocate for yourself is huge and to your point too really treating yourself in a different
[00:55:58] light seeing you and honoring where you're where you are and where you're going it's
[00:56:03] huge the more we dismiss ourselves shame ourselves it's just the harder it is and we don't really
[00:56:07] feel more in that place so yeah that's really important so thank you so we talked a little bit
[00:56:14] a lot a bit about what you do and I will link all of her information below if you'd like to work
[00:56:19] with her where they can find you so something I like to ask everyone just at the end as a
[00:56:25] little fun question what are you loving right now and you're well in this journey and it
[00:56:29] could be anything from literally like a new breath technique to a recipe to I don't know a whole new
[00:56:34] thing I have really been on fire about crinium sacral and visceral work recently there's an
[00:56:39] institute out there that really teaches that stuff and I've just been like diving into
[00:56:43] the education standpoint and it has it's been so much fun for me as a practitioner and like so
[00:56:48] great to be able to like offer that to patients and point them like my virtual patients I can
[00:56:53] point them to where to get that done but long story short is it's this way of like
[00:56:58] we're talking about subconscious but it's all the osteopathic techniques where you're learning to
[00:57:01] follow the body's cues on more of like a reflexive level energies to to subtle of a word it's not
[00:57:07] energy it's like a fascial pull and you're listening to what the body wants first instead
[00:57:12] of just like where the symptoms lead me so it's it's really exciting because I'm just
[00:57:17] seeing some cool changes and teaching people to pay attention to that stuff in their own body
[00:57:21] but it's like a way to kind of get us out of our own head because I don't know all the answers
[00:57:26] the person's body does though so it's like how can I maybe even shortcut like talking to the
[00:57:30] conscious or subconscious and just listen to their body and I love it it's just it's very
[00:57:34] fun for me it's like I get to be a little bit of a magician while I'm being a PT and teach
[00:57:39] other people to kind of be a magician to their own body so that's what I'm kind of pumped up
[00:57:42] about right now craniosacral and visceral work which I think are awesome pretty very safe
[00:57:48] resources for those listening that they're set trainings and that you could find local
[00:57:53] manual therapists that help you that's amazing we've we've actually had an episode coming out on
[00:57:57] craniosacral that I'm really excited about so right on track and I think the main point in that is
[00:58:04] not only you will both right the practitioner and the person learning how to take use from their body
[00:58:09] because yes our body is so amazing and powerful and self-healing if we can tune into it and
[00:58:16] let it do its job so just asking the body and asking parts so you can break your body to
[00:58:20] parts if it's better like hey uterus what do you need right now is it emotional is it physical is
[00:58:26] it is it a hot pack is it this and it sounds so silly but yeah our body knows our body knows
[00:58:31] so much I think it's so wise knows what we need to do to heal yeah for sure okay thank you so
[00:58:38] much for being on there I can't wait to hear more about everything you're doing too yeah thanks
[00:58:43] Kendall really appreciate it I know that this is a wealth of information and more to come so
[00:58:48] thank you ID virtual evaluations and either physical therapy and lead people through like
[00:58:54] exercise programs and I have like online video exercise programs that I help people with and then
[00:58:59] I also kind of just work as a life coach and help me find those local resources so if anyone
[00:59:03] has been along some similar journeys and is interested I think we'll link that and
[00:59:08] love to hear from you and do free consult calls but um hoping to I have a Instagram
[00:59:13] and slowly gets more of this information out there that way too so yeah we'll have everything
[00:59:19] I feel like I love to just get the info out there so appreciate it yeah she has awesome
[00:59:24] she's a wealth of information and we'll have everything linked and again I can speak to it
[00:59:28] to her work because I was her patient so yeah okay thanks again and thanks for tuning in bye
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[01:00:03] hope on your journey